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Leaf Trimmer?

Are any of you using a “leaf trimmer” like the Trim Pro?
We are at the point where de-leafing has become a major time commitment.
What are your favorite ways to pop fan leaves before harvest?

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Tagging some of the trimmer vendors so they can jump in with their thoughts:
@dalton @dana

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@TwisterTrimmer

Here at Twister, we manufacture the highest quality of harvesting equipment. We have 3 models currently on the market (T2,T4,T6). We have been around for 10 years, and consider ourselves to be pioneers in the harvesting side of the industry.

Check us out @mx2forty www.twistertrimmer.com

Feel free to call me @ 1-888-254-3204 ext 702 to discuss.

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Guys,
I appreciate the feedback. Dalton, we already have your Twister Trimmers. I was looking for something that we could use to remove fan leaves after harvesting but before bucking. I know it can be a labor intensive process and will never be fast but was just looking at my options for workflow.

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Have to give a shout out for my Canopy cohort colleague Jon Gowa over at www.BloomAutomation.com

He’s brilliant, the tech is beyond cool, and it may be worthwhile for you to check it out

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We use a Trimpro XL unit. They’re useful in dealing with B-grade product and opens up more time for trimming A-grade flower. They can do the work of 4-6 workers so regardless of the relatively high cost, they pay for themselves…

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Hey @mx2forty, folks are using Trimpro like products, another one that seems to work a little better is made by Trimbros (out of southern Oregon). We have noticed that people who use the Trimpro type product vs hand de-leafing do end up spending more time cleaning up crows feet etc because the process isn’t as clean so depending on what grade you are going for you may save some time upfront, but then add time on the back end in the QC. That is our experience. www.thetriminator.com. Let us know if you have any other questions we can help on.

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Great question. So you’re looking for automation to help remove fan leaves to cut down on stress during the bucking process? I’m assuming you’re bucking by hand?

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Thanks for all the comments. We are bucking with this.. It is amazing but I am working through the best way to deal with fan leaves. We have always de-leaved by hand, sometimes before chop and sometimes after. I think with the right system we can separate the flower from the fans after machine bucking but was curious if anyone else had used trim pro type devices.

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@mx2forty Guessing you’d be trimming dry?

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Steve, we have tried both ways. our production schedule and the quality of product is better if we trim at a certain moisture level (for now) which would be considered dry.

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@mx2forty

We’ve found that “dry” as considered by some at 7% is too dry for good trim results. Our testing has always found the sweet spot is 10.5-11.5% (anywhere between 8-13 depending on cultivar and conditions) followed by proper curing… Not sure if this is similar to what you guys have found.

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Very interesting point Steve. In working with our 15+ Sales Managers across the US, we find that the exact moisture levels vary from state to state since the climates are so different. Typically, our ‘company line’ on our Dry Trimmers is 7-8% on the moisture meter. However, while that seems to work for Colorado, California is a little dryer and the PNW (WA, OR) is more moist. Because of that, we get a ton of feedback with different trimmers using different moisture contents on different strains. One thing is for sure though, once you dial those numbers in, you can produce a fabulous product through our machine.

I know this isn’t related to the removal of fan leaves, but you guys have an interesting conversation going and I thought I would weigh in. Happy trimming everyone!

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@GreenBroz True it isn’t related to fan leaves :slight_smile:

On Dry… I get your comment and thanks for the update on how many sales staff you have.

Nothing personal but GB trimmers only work on extremely brittle and dry product. Unfortunately this forces the grower to dry down to levels of 5-7% for the machine to work… which kind of maybe explains the need for 15+ sales staff in market to convince everyone to dry to what fits your machines vs. the machine fitting the needs of the growers. Conversely, Twister builds machines to fit a wide range of growers and their drying techniques vs. going out and teaching growers how to grow and dry. Our machines are extemely flexible, and work on dry product between 8-13% moisture level which allows us to meet the grower at the level they are comfortable drying to.

Also… 5-7% is simply too small of a range to offer in a machine and you know this. If a growers product ends up a bit too high on moisture - say 9% - a GB machine will gum up with trikes and require your lubricant to continue to operate. Hence your dry lubricant /oil. https://www.greenbroz.com/product/greenbroz-machine-oil/. This is a well known problem in the industry across medium to large harvests where moisture content can vary 1-3% across the entire harvest. “Machine Oil” is not the answer for variations in dry.

Twisters require zero lubricant to operate between 8-13% and can handle any variations in moisture across medium to large harvests. Extremely flexible… which supports your comment about different requirements for different strains/states, etc)… So in essence you agree that Twister’s are the better option. Thank you for that!

Also - “Dialing in those numbers” is really nothing more than ensuring the grower dries their product to uber bone dry for the machine to work. Then, the machine can roll brittlely dry product on itself for 20 minutes “batch-style” with ongoing help from the end user (you call this gentle)… and the trim falls through the spinning metal grooves (you call these blades) into a receptacle. IMO this is very similar to a toms tumble trimmer or a trim bag… which operate this way as well (and they do a great job at a super competitive price point!!).

Anyways, thanks for the comment! Always love talking shop.

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Yikes. So much for a welcoming reception to some information.

Never said 5-7%…if you read the post we mentioned 7-8%, which is a company line because you have to provide a jumping off point and to say that every strain would need the same moisture would be incorrect, so no matter what strain, you need to dial in the optimal moisture content. We have growers who use low double digits for moisture and have no trouble with ‘gumming up’ the machine.

We’re very clear in our phrasing that our machine oil is designed to clean our machine (what little residue there is). And, if you read or watch any of our instructional videos, we use a Teflon ring to avoid the use of lubrication. However, IF a grower decides to use it as a lubrication, it is an all-natural, plant-based product with testing (also listed on our site) that shows it passes the most rigorous standards for quality. In addition, IF the grower wants to use a lubricant, we only recommend 1-2 drops between blades, which is nothing.

We don’t, and will never, compare our machines to other companies and we don’t speak badly about other machines. There is room in the industry for everyone and our ever-growing client list speaks for itself. View some of that list here (http://bit.ly/2v0xUx7).

We will gladly attend any ‘trim offs’ we are invited to. We continue to be the choice of large-scale cultivators across the United States, as well as Canada and overseas (7 Acres MMJ in Canada is one of the largest grows in the country, proudly using our machines, for example).

Also see ‘The Clinic’s’ review of our machine, one of the most well-respected cultivators in Colorado, dozens of cannabis cup awards, Cultivator and Dispensary of the year (http://www.thecliniccolorado.com/the-clinics-awards/) - awards from pre-GreenBroz when they hand trimmed and since-GreenBroz when they machine trim. Can’t make that up. And there are plenty more medium-large grows with unpaid reviews to check out HERE as well. (http://bit.ly/2v0xUx7)

In terms of sales force, we employ Sales Managers across the country so that we can provide live demonstrations for people. Our machine offers a number of features that we love to share with our clients, and the client-company relationship we form between our customers is important to us. We never want to be just a machine company, we want to work with our clients as much as possible because their feedback and experiences help us learn what other machines we can develop for the industry. It’s an invaluable tool. Not to mention we’re trying to undo years and years of stigma associated with automated trimming from companies who came along long before us, or you. Because of that, we love seeing the looks on our clients faces when we get a chance to show them what we can do for them.

In addition to the awesome relationships we create, which is what business is all about for us, our machine offers a level of ‘customized automation’ like very few can. Because of that, we love to talk to the cultivators about their options and how our machine can best work in their process. It’s not a ‘dump it in one end, it comes out the other end’ sort of machine. The GROWER has control of the trim throughout the entire process. If they want to trim 100% with our machine, they can. However, most top-notch grows we work with trim 80-90% in our machine, then kick out to finish by hand. This allows them to maintain a hand-trimmed presentation(no golf-balling or pine-coning), but still cut out 80-90% of their labor. It’s one of many great features to our machine (speed control, size sorting, I could go on).

If you don’t like our machine, that’s fine, but please don’t spread misinformed information about our products as it only makes the entire industry look petty and immature.

Best Wishes.

Just a reminder to keep things friendly as you discuss the pros and cons of your respective products. As long as the debate doesn’t turn into a flamewar then I think it benefits the community for you guys to be comparing how each of your products works best.

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Yo @GreenBroz. As far as I know this forum is for growers and information that helps them make great decisions. The dry conversation is important for readers on GN and since you brought up your company, your sales fleet, your “company line” on dry trimming (7-8%) and a bunch of comments about variations between states and regions - I felt it was an awesome opportunity to open up the conversation to discuss machines and how they relate to this variability across regions + discuss the variations in the word “dry” and people’s interpretations of what dry trimming is to them.

As for misinformation. your website says this.

I rounded this out to 5-7… my bad, it should have read 5-8%

My point on flexibility stands. No one is bashing your machines, simply challenging your points and the facts/stats you communicate in your marketing throughout trade shows, Facebook, up and down the coast in demos, etc.

Last time I checked this forum is for growers - definitely not a marketing channel for company’s to post and link to brochures, testimonials and such. Growers need constructive conversations and facts and data to support it.

More of that maybe and less GB marketing… Just saying.

Appreciate the feedback. The only reason I’m linking videos is that I think growers would rather hear it from growers, instead of a company rep. I would love to see some videos of your growers talking about your machines, where can I check them out?

Our machine results are backed by independent, third-party testing from Steep Hills Labs, who do a great job. I’ll link them here in case people want to read them for themselves so I’m not translating (http://greenbroz.com/test-results/). (Only posted so I don’t get in trouble for ‘interpreting’ the results.)

I’ve commented with testimonials, reviews and test results because, like you said, it’s a growers site, and people should hear the feedback from the growers themselves. My intent is not to come across as a ‘marketing’ voice, but linking video/articles/websites is just something I do (started in college years ago because I had to do it…I guess I’ve never stopped). I just always believe that there are people smarter than me out there, who have done it longer and with more success, like growing for instance. Because of that, I tend to use those experts to make my point for me. I’ll try to use my own opinions more, but I’ll typically always try to post back up to explain why I think how I do.

Your screenshot is absolutely right. You want the outside leaf to be very taught and easily breakable, while the center core of the flower maintains its moisture. That is the proper flower prep for our machine. The moisture number itself will vary, but we’ve done the research to get us to that jumping off point as a start. Typically, our clients work with their Sales Managers closely to get the process dialed in out of the gate. They’ve been around the trimmer, and grows, for a long time and the ‘dialing in’ process happens very quickly, often in only 1-2 runs. It may not be for every grower out there, and that’s ok. Different strokes for different folks.

That being said, our machines are also extremely flexible and we see a range in moisture levels very similar to your machine depending on the grower and market. We also find that the growers love the control over the process. Some trim 100% in our machines and some only go 75-90%, and finish by hand for the craft look, while still saving a ton on labor. They get to decide that. So it’s a customizable automation of sorts, which is different from your product offering and that’s fine. Again, different strokes for different folks.

No matter what trimmer or harvest process you go with, we encourage you to demo multiple machines and processes so that you can find what works best for you.

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