I had two strains (one pure sativa and one pure indica) I kept going for 20 years with no degradation. Never used a mother plant. In fact, I sold some cutttings from the sativa to another grower 15 years ago who is still growing them. That makes that line 35 years old. Still going strong.
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Last year I was given some landrace sativa seed that the locals call UFO. Interesting in that the males had cream colored flowers with purple stripes. But more to the point, one plant had all of its leaves variegated green and white.
I was tempted to clone it but it was both a male and smaller than the others so it was culled.
The thing about genetic abnormalities is that there is often a good chance that the sport plant may offer something no prior plant had.
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Ah! I’d love to be able to tour a facility really diving into the genetics of our plant. I wonder if it could alter the yield enough to get more people into it.
I could see in the CO market this becoming a trend, because there are already a lot of clones being sold. I could only imagine if the grower could only buy clones and not be able to breed it themselves. Tons of revenue opportunity, and in this country that will definitely light a fire under someone!
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The answer is meristem propagation.
You can not only check the DNA and virus status of the cloned plant but also make, in theory, unlimited seedlings.
This is standard in the orchid field and with other high value flower crops. It’s my understanding that it’s being expanded to Cannabis in Amsterdam where the labs already exist for flower cloning.
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I like to have mothers just to make sure I can keep them super healthy, separated, and labeled correctly, and that I’m taking the best cuttings. But I agree with everyone that clonal degradation is largely a myth. Random genetic mutations can occur, however, and the longer you have a strain (and the more stress it’s in), the more likely that a mutation will eventually occur. Basing production decisions on a fear of this is probably irrational though. Keep it healthy!
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Whatever works for you in your facility. I know plenty of people who do mothers and veg in sealed tents.
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When done properly, Tissue Culture is a great alternative to keep mothers alive or cloning from clones. We already allow our members to propose Tissue Cultures but there are very few options available at the moment, and they go fast.
It seems that having a constant and consequent inventory of TCs is very costly compared to traditional nurseries, hence the limitations in supply.
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I have a strain that I have had for around 20yrs and have only cloned. I feel it’s producing better now than ever before. I will also say that lights have evolved since then and I believe that has to be factored in also.
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I also have taken clones from clones from clones…from the same plant that I received after it had been cloned for over 30 years. She’s still going strong!
I think it boils down largely to preference and the production needs of your facility.
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It would be really interesting to do genotype analyses between “generations” of clones and see if/when and magnitude of variations.
@LabOwner and @LabEmployees please feel free to chime in 
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I also wonder if we might see signs of genetic drift from generation to generation of clones from clones (as has long been the supposition).
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Funny I was sent this a while ago … and was wondering the same myself.
https://www.wired.com/story/whats-in-a-cannabis-strain-name/
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I hate genetic impostors! They’re so fake!
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[quote=“Farmer_Dan, post:5, topic:9826”]
One of my most favorite varieties of hops is Saaz, traditionally used for Czech Pilsner
[/quote
Yes please one pint. Cold.
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The clones can be cloned without any issues. providing clean genetics. and clean procedures are followed.
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I keep some mothers and finally can get roots on cuts with an aeroponic cloner, but then getting the clone to take off after planted into 3 in. peat pots seems to take forever if at all. Just seems like so much more work than popping beans, I almost feel like it’s a hindrance to what I feel is my real job of preserving landraces in as close to original genetics as I can. We all read Rob Clarke’s book, right ? We are all lucky enough to be stewards of this wonderful mystical plant handed down to each one of us from antiquity !!! I hope you will all join me as I feel it is our duty to preserve these great landrace genetics that some cultures have been selecting towards for generations ! Don’t get me wrong I love a sticky gooey hybrid just as much as anyone but we have to remember what just about all breeders started with, bag seeds from Mexico, Columbia, Thailand and Afghanistan . Ok I’m done ranting for now, soap box anyone ?
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My numbers tell me clones knock off about 45 days. And they have the added age of the mother. Seeds are slow. I like my seeds. I very rarely cut clones. I did two SuperMale x JOG as she was realy really nice. might keep her around a while.
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we can’t let it!!! NO GMO!!! keep your genetics clean and healthy 
[sad thing is this probably already has happened 
]
@thatgatesguy
all jokes aside, i’m of the healthy plants healthy clone school of thought but honestly i see it as a space/time constraint of keeping the moms more then anything, yet to see anyone prove either way right… with questions like this sometimes i want to say… if it ain’t broke don’t fix it… battling this either way i could see someone making mistakes repeatedly cloning and have no clones, or could see something (fill in x cause) killing a mother plant…
point is… i think when it comes to this question… what works for you? whats your set-up? more importantly whats your operational model? where does either fit into the workflow operation and which will be more efficient in the requiring the least amount of labor cost to you? i could continue asking qualifying questions but if what you are doing is preserving your end result consistently, if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it… yet to see anyone prove either way is the true gold standard
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The industry side is quickly moving to specialty growers for liners. Just like traditional floricultue. For most grow the specialized space for liners is prohibitively expensive or requires skill and technical skills they do not understand. Tissues culture is going to be critical in stock line cleaning lots of desese are accumulating. As a business model look at both geranium cutting production. Bob Ogelvy, rebuilt a dying crop. In the 1970’s and 1980’s. Good articles in greenhouse management magazine and the old grower talks.
Pan American seed changed seed production in the US so much the Dutch took notice. Look for plug production. Lots of small grower don’t even try to start there own begonia or petunia seeds any more. It is so much easier to buy trays of seedlings.
The last time I need specialty begonia and petunia seedling, I job the plugs out to a giant operation in Nebraska. I had to supply the very special seed. And I sweet for ten weeks over the begonia seedlings. But, we had a client who would pay florist prices.
In house large scale propigation has high risks that are difficult to midagate.
From the voices in my head
Ethan
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