Above is a section of our field as of yesterday.
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Looking good!
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I am an edible maker that just started using cannabis derived cbd isolate in my edible line.
What are the benefits that you see in adding cbd to thc edibles? 1:1 ratio is what we are producing. I know why I love how they work together but I have not had the chance to ask someone who specializes in cbd…thank you.
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So I recently heard that while people are selling CBD products online, a lot of that is made out of industrial hemp powders or dubious quality hemp from China. And that cannabis-derived CBD product would still be considered federally illegal. Could you explain the difference between hemp and cannabis to me? It’s the same plant, right? So how is it so different?
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I love the sunbeams in the photo! 
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I can try to answer your question @Changemaker-Lilli. There’s some contention whether indica, sativa, and ruderalis are different species or subspecies, but hemp and cannabis in general can interbreed and produce viable offspring, making them the same species via the Breeding Species definition.
It’s a lot like gray wolves and dogs. They are the same species, and they can interbreed. Biology is just confusing that way.
The problem is when biology and the law run into each other. Biology almost never deals in absolutes (there’s all sorts of weird crossover going on, convergent evolution, viruses transplanting genes, mutations, etc), and the law almost always requires absolutes. The way I understand it, most states define the difference between hemp and cannabis at 0.2% THC – that is that hemp contains less than 0.2% and cannabis contains more.
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That makes so much sense. Thanks!
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About 3 years ago me and my team created Pennywise using Cannatonic and Jack the Ripper.
Over the next 3 years working with Chef Joel of Norstar genetics we developed Dead Lights and today we got this full spectrum test in,
There is also a 12/12 pheno but these results seem spectacular, especially considering the terp profile.
My question is simple are these not exceptional numbers from a seed plant.
Subcool
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I’m a huge fan of Pennywise!
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I really don’t work with CBD isolate much. Sure, I have some lying around the house as people like to send me samples in hopes that I will buy from them, but it doesn’t work for me. I got a headache both time I tried it as well. Why? Well, most CBD Isolate is created from using a CO2 extraction then washing it with hexane. Obviously it is impossible to purge out all of the hexane (which is toxic). Many people aren’t sensitive to hexane though and don’t have this issue. Another issue with hexane extracted isolate is that when you have toxins in a compound that your body absorbs, you body will actually try to avoid absorbing the toxins which screws up the bioavailability of the CBD isolate itself. I would imagine you can create a pure CBD from distillation as well but I’m sure it would be a little different. Truthfully I have zero experience working with distillation equipment so that is just my guess. There may be other ways to make isolate now that I’m not aware of as well. You may want to ask for hexane residual tests from your supplier if you want to avoid any complaints.
The great thing about CBD isolate is that it is incredibly inexpensive. You will get the same quailty of isolate if it is extracted from a hemp stalk or a marijuana strain containing amounts of CBD such as Girl Scoot Cookies. In the future CBD isolate will probably be added to cereal and other products to help keep the endocannabinoid system healthy. I really think that’s the spot it will take as it isn’t near as effective as full spectrum CBD oils. Studies done by Dr Allan Frankel have shown that the highest grades of CBD can be 100 times more effective than molecular CBD:
http://www.greenbridgemed.com/why-is-cannabis-dosed-by-gram-and-not-milligram/
It’s rather odd as I have heard that THC isolate will make you want to hide under your bed because you will get so paranoid but CBD isolate just doesn’t have much effect on the user. However, isolate gives some people enough relief. So, there are fans out there. There is still so much to learn and I feel like the cannabis industry is really just getting started on understanding how these compounds work.
We were the first company to start adding limonene to our products. About a year later isolate companies started doing this and started claiming that their isolate was full spectrum. We feel this does not add much to the effectiveness of the CBD very much if at all. We started doing it as we thought it MAY help some, but we did it more to have natural flavors added that were consistent with naturally occurring compounds in cannabis. I have a whole drawer of different terpenes and in experiments I have not found them to make the CBD better when added. And limonene tastes great when vaped. We were really excited about working with linalool as pure linalool smells straight up like fruity pebbles, but smell and taste are a different thing. Pure myrcene smells like a slot car track, etc.
So, the entourage effect is extremely important when referring to CBD consumption. Most marijuana strains have very little difference in cannabinoid ratios but they have different effects. This is due to terpene profiles. So why does adding terpenes not change the effects of CBD? From our knowledge and experience, once the bond is broken, the integrity of the entourage effect is destroyed. You will notice that RSO is extracted using ethanol in most cases these days. Not only does ethanol extract both polar and non-polar compounds giving the finished oil a very close representaion of the genetics, but it actually extracts all the compounds at once opposed to methods that extract different compounds at different times before throwing them back together. When comparing the effectiveness of ethanol extracted CBD vs methods that rip the compounds apart, you will find that the EHO is much more effective.
Theoretically an EHO tincture made from a 1:1 plant will have different effects then combining 2 different plants (one THC dominant and one CBD dominant). With other means of extraction methods it may not make much of a difference as the bonds are broken already. So, with your products you will most likely get some added benefits, but it won’t have the exact same effects as if it was an EHO from a 1:1. Users are likely to have less negative side effects from the THC in your products and the user will also get the benefits from the isolate as well. Overall, I think it’s a great way to add benefits to your products without the burden of high material costs!
I’d love to hear your thoughts on this as well 
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I think much of the hemp is actually grown in the EU and processed in China. You can find it all over on the website called Alibaba.
Hemp and marijuana are both cannabis. Below is an article I wrote a few months ago that may be of some help:
https://4cornerscannabis.com/hemp-vs-marijuana/
CBD derived from marijuana is technically illegal to ship across State lines though. Companies such as Sisters of the Valley still do it though.
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Right! I posted it on instagram the other day and hadn’t noticed it until it was blown up on here. The sun is pretty cool
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Are these numbers exceptional? YES! Great job!!!
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I personally feel Indica and Sativa will be phased out in the future in some sort of manner. Ruderalis are obviously a little different as they have autoflower traits. But plants really come down to chemical compositions. Indicas = couchlock when grown out to terpene maturity while Sativas tend to be more energetic. My understanding is that the Afghani #1 was brought over to the States in the early 80’s as growers had trouble hiding huge sativa plants. If you research genetics, you will find that many of the “Indicas” in existence tend to have roots in the Afghani #1, Well, the Afghani #1 from what I have seen tends to have high levels of myrcene. And myrcene is resposible for “Couch lock”. After many hours looking at labs, I have noticed that “Sativas” tend to have less myrcene so that is most likely why the high is more energetic. Obviously THCV can come into the equation as well, but you hardly see strains that are supposed to have decent levels of THCV actually have levels over .3%. I’m not sure if it is because of a lack of UVB or that growers choose plants on structure, yield, etc over more important chemical composition traits. I would persoanlly love to grow some Doug Varins even if they had 3 foot internode spacing and only yielded a gram per plant, haha. But, you will also find that some sativas have decent amounts of myrcene, and in theory I would think that these plants would give the user more of an “indica” type high.
In other words, I think it is much easier to guess the effects from a plant from the chemical composition than what it looks like. In the CBD “hemp” industry we have to work with a lot of clones because we need to abide by certain THC levels. I have started with “Sativas” and after a year they started adapting to the arid climate in Colorado to have more of a broad leaf structure. I think the “nurture” aspect of genetics is grossly underlooked by most people.
Traditional hemp is just cannabis “Sativa” that has been bred for fiber production for the last 10,000 years or so. When you breed out the terpenes, cannbinoids, etc, then the plant has more energy to spend on creating strong fiber.
And close. “Legally” cannabis sativa at or under .3% THC is considered hemp under international law.
Most CBD on the market comes from these fiber hemp genetics and that is why the effectiveness is so low when comparing to plants that have been bred for human consumption. Is all hemp bad? NO. Is most of it? Yes.
We had a recent lab test of our “hemp” show 2.31% terpenes with 19.52% total CBD. This blows ACDC labs out of the water.
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below 0.3%
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Awesome discussion. Super helpful to get many perspectives. Fascinating to hear about differing results via different extraction methods of the same material. It makes sense when you stop for a second to think about it.
I some questions - is anyone growing these very low THC stains indoors? Are there actually strains out there that reliably test at <.3% that are actually worth growing?
Finally does the market support small scale “artisan” growers producing exclusively these very low THC flowers?
Thanks for your answers!
Oliver
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Not a lot of people grow these strains indoors. At this point most CBD genetics aren’t super stable. There are tons of hermie genetics out there. And many CBD dominant genetics that don’t herm outdoors will herm indoors under artificial light. THC levels tend to slightly go up under artificial lights as well makes pheno-hunting quite difficult when searching for plants that are under .3% THC.
Many people claim that they have seeds that will consistently pass under .3% but many of these will run over .5% THC. All plants will be under .3% THC at some stage of their lives, haha. Most hemp growers grow clone only strains. We started with 150 different crosses and narrowed the pool down to 2 cultivars that we are growing.
We plan to sell flower this year
I hope this is of some help. Please let me know if you have any further questions and I will do my best to be of help.
I have included a picture of our field if you are curious about what we do.
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That’s interesting that the CBD genetics are less stable. I wonder what the cause for that is?
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Well, the Afghani #1 was brought to the States in the early 80’s to make it easier for growers to hide their plants in comparison to Sativas. Most indicas have some roots in this strain. So, most cannabis genetics have been worked with for almost 40 years.
Then you have CBD dominant genetics that were discovered a little before 2010. Breeders have be accidentally been breeding THC out for almost 40 years. So, it is very difficult to find phenos that are CBD dominant. It’s much easiest to backtrack to landrace when looking for CBD dominant genetics. So, when you find something, you kind of have to start working with it. And these genetics have not been stabilized for generations like most THC dominant genetics.
Irresponsible breeding plays a part as well.
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It’s possible there’s a large epigenetic factor to CBD as well, which can result in relatively quick changes between generations without any DNA instability.
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